Michel's Own Statements

[Bastian]

Successfully interpreting your dream and realizing why you behave like in a dream is a good way to learn the weakness of your life and it could bring some interesting transformation in the physical life. Dream usually amplifies the things that you need to learn in physical life.

Bomo, This so very very true! My dreams tell me so much about the progress of my psyche. They let me know when I am falling backwards into selfish behaviour patterns, or improving. I am convinced that HS proposes unusual situations to test me and see how I react and how I will react under various circumstances (eg: to see if you would risk your life to help people).

But occasionally there are messages that I am certain do not come from the HS. I did have one event where I was warned of a harmful 'discovery' that was about to be announced. Something that could be used as a weapon. From memory I think this was more like a telepathic message than a dream, probably from someone who is observing us in astral body and decided to warn me. Since there is nothing I could have done to stop this 'discovery', I then wonder what its purpose was.. is it merely to prove to me that I need to pay heed to such telepathic messages if I receive them in future??.

[Vesko]

Leo -- one correction -- you said that Vesko (me) allows only certain posts. There is no filtering going on on the forum. Not even one post has been ever moderated. However, if there is misuse or proven garbage, steps will be taken.
I am glad that you've found my answers useful, but as I'm sure you realize most of them are only scratching the surface. It'd be interesting to see what our just registered member Robanan has to say (remember him? )?

[Bastian]

I read this forum (and occasionally contribute) not because Vesko answers all questions and only allows certain posts (as Tom does), but because a group of people willing to put forth ideas and experiences that we can all share and make up our own minds.

Hi Leo,
Vesko is telling the truth, we have not been moderating or deleting other peoples posts. In fact, the major stimulus for the creation of this forum was the desire to allow people a greater degree of self expression whilst debating the book Thiaoouba Prophecy.

However this freedom of self expression is not absolute, as we do intend to moderate or delete posts that are disrespectful towards the forum and its member (eg: spam, or abusive language). Otherwise the forum could easily degenerate into something much like the Usenet.

Given what I have seen of Tom Chalkos past attempts to post on the Usenet, I can understand why he chose the present format for his readers forum. He has his filters set pretty high , and this will have some advantages for Tom as he then decides what direction the forum takes.

[Guest]

Leo wrote:
I read this forum (and occasionally contribute) not because Vesko answers all questions and only allows certain posts (as Tom does), but because a group of people willing to put forth ideas and experiences that we can all share and make up our own minds.

Please forgive me Vesko, I meant I read this forum NOT because you allow only some posts and answer all questions...

I mean that is to say you DON'T filter comments and answer all questions. Sorry must be my Aussie lingo and the way I say things, hope I didn't offend.

[Leo]

Ooops sorry last post was mine, just realized I didn't log in

[Kestrel]

Ooops sorry last post was mine, just realized I didn't log in

Sure it was

[purpleprincessts]

Analysing the dream world will one day result in Lucid Dreaming. Have you ever had such an experience??

I have had many lucid dreams. Sadly most of them have been unpleasent. One problem I have is that in a lucid dream state I forget that I can controll the content of the dream.

[Alisima]

That is one of the problems, that once you become lucid you soon will forget your newly discovered facts. Don't be distured though, you will get the knack of it, sooner or later.

Why do you want to change the contents of your dream?? It might be that in the very effort of controlling you may loose you lucidity. It might sound silly but I don't think you can change the content of your dream, at least not all, since large parts of you dream are still fabricated by your subconscious. I once tried to meditate in a dream. So the minute I got lucid I forgot the dream I was currently dreaming, sat down and closed my eyes. What I saw was the normal blackness you would see when you close your eyes, accompanied with spatial awareness, as if the blackness had any depth. Because I was fully asleep and was not even moving in my dream I did not fell my body at all, nor did I even thought of it, only afterwards. So there was no boundary of my being, just awareness in black space. And I was floating, floating like never before, it was nice. Then I suddenly realised that my body was just lying in bed and I could not help it but I started to feel my body. Lying on my back under the bedsheets and with my head on a pillow. The floating became less, and the static feeling of lying in bed became stronger. And stronger, and stronger. Untill I finally opened my eyes and was awake again. Although there was no shift in conscious, from the point I deceided to meditate in my dream and to the point of awakening I had the same level of awareness. The only difference in my dreaming and being awake was the feeling of my body. You can try it for yourself, it is real easy, just become lucid, forget the dream and close you eyes, you don't even have to sit down, there is no body.

Although you can trick yourself into thinking you have awakened but actually are still dreaming, simply close your eyes again.

So the difference between lucid dreaming and normal dreaming is a different level of awareness. You can create what some call, mental flexibility. By doing thing which normally can't. Like dividing yourself, defying gravity, walking through walls, etc. But remember the matrix, there is no spoon. There are no walls in your dreams, there is no gravity and there is no you. In fact, there is no dream either. It is all a facade. Although the appearance of the facade tells you something about your sub- and unconscious, it tells you nothing about what is behind it.

So changing the content of your dream is not the purpose of becoming lucid. The purpose of becoming lucid is to understand what is happening and to grow in awareness. Really, you can try moving mountains in you dreams, and you will succeed. But there are no mountains, so what does that tell you about your effort in moving them?? It is futile. There is no movement, only yourself deceiving yourself.

Although as a stepping stone you can first create mental flexibility, you can change heaven and earth to give you confidence in your dreaming. It is quite nice when you are attacked by monster that you can divide yourself into a million man army. But I have fought millions of battles in my dreams and they keep coming. There is no end, simply because it is nonexistent. It is like fighting a mirror. It is because of YOU that there are monsters in the first place. (or anything else which bothers you.)

Understand it, embrace it, love it, and it will disappear.

[dloheb]

Whether Thiaoouba exists or not is NOT relevant. It will not help us in any way.

We need to help ourselves.

So what if Thiaoouba is a lie?? Does it really matter?? Will you lose any knowledge?? Will it be a step back in your progress??

No.

You have to do what you feel is right. That is the only way to evolve.

After reading Thiaoouba Prophecy i tried convincing other people. And guess what?? It didnt work.

One thing Thiaoouba Prophecy learned me is NOT to believe what other people say, including Thiaoouba Prophecy ITSELF. In that way I will learn from meself. Which is more valuable than ANY book.

Sorry if i have offended some. But the big question is not whether you believe in Thiaoouba Prophecy, but what to do NEXT? What to do TOMORROW? And the day after that.

Like tom said: "What have you learned today?"

The only thing I am almost certain of is that one's intellect evolves. However, I find the word 'intellect' to be broad, so it may not be seperate from other symbols such as 'spirituality'. I suppose this isn't very relevant - I just wanted to clarify before I continue.

I've only read the Freedom of Choice and the Thiaoouba Prophecy once, even though it is suggested that you read through it three times. I can't bring myself to re-read or even re-watch things I have already sat through, as I'm quite impatient. Or lazy. I think I have internalized the core concepts of the two books.

On my search for spiritual knowledge I have observed that there is a lot of room for people to believe in different things. To elaborate, Mr. Chalko, as an initiate of the Quan Yin method, has beliefs (I'm assuming he believes in the Thiaoouba Prophecy) that contradict the teachings of Master Ching Hai, who is considered by many to be at the epitome of spiritual understanding on earth. http://godsdirectcontact.org/ for information on that method of enlightenment.

Everywhere I look, even in organized religion, people contradict one another in what they believe. I, on the other hand, do not understand how anyone can believe anything if they know their neighbour does in something else. Everyone believes with all their heart and mind. Now take note that I'm talking about "deeper" or more wholistic beliefs, a concept which I have difficulty putting into form here, but I'm sure you know what I mean (if you can make sense of that jabber).

As the "intellect" is an evolutionary process it would be normal for some people to have a more complete understanding than others. My point: some beliefs would be more correct than others, and some wrong altogether, and if the Thiaoouba prophecy is a creation of the imagination it is damaging to that spiritual, or intellectual, evolution. I guess not if it has an indirect sort of affect, but I still think perpetuating false information (particularly at that level) is harmful and shouldn't be done intentionally.

Maybe the after-life is whatever you imagine it to be? That makes more sense than everyone thinking it's something slightly else. It cannot be everything at once unless it is of one's own creation. Atleast that's a presumption restricted to my intellect. Wouldn't that be lame?

So I suppose I have to make my own discovery. But how can you trust your own reality? How can you trust what you have learned today? That is the problem to begin with, is it not? VERY frustrating!

[jamen]

[

Analysing the dream world will one day result in Lucid Dreaming. Have you ever had such an experience??

I had 3 lucid dreaming in a short period of time, the first one was a wonderful experience.

[Robanan]

Thank you for having brought this topic to my attention, I can't say exactly how it slipped away from my sight for such a long time.

It'd be interesting to see what our just registered member Robanan has to say (remember him? )?

I'm here Vesko... wheew, finally!

I think it would be best if I start here from the beginning...

Did you have an interest in UFOs and extraterrestrials before
your abduction?

No! When people would speak of such things, I would smile. I
did not think it was impossible, but I thought it was probably
not so.

...and this is from Thiaoouba Prophecy: (emphasis mine)

I had often spoken with friends of ‘flying saucers’ and was persuaded that they did, in fact, exist - but when you are actually faced with the reality, so many questions cloud your brain that you think it will burst.

Anyone?

Well I've been reading all that was said about it, I must say I don't see any problem at all because of the following reasons:

1- It is obvious from the quoted text of the interview that before his abduction Michel has 'often' talked with his friends about aliens and flying saucers even though it must have taken a lot of time for him to take some arguments seriously and consider them possible enough to be 'persuaded' by them. Notice the notions "I did not think is was impossible", "it was propably not so" and "was persuaded that they did, in fact, exist".

2- It is obvious that Michel had a lot in his mind about aliens and flying saucers to the point that when according to his words as he faced reality "so many questions clouded his brain that he thought it will burst"

The apparent cotradiction that you detected in Michels words is biased with your own misunderstanding.

"SCHIZOPHRENIA IS NOT "SPLIT-PERSONALITY." There is a common misconception that schizophrenia is multiple personalities or a Dr. Jekyll-Mr. Hyde syndrome. This is NOT accurate. In fact, multiple personality disorder is an entirely different disorder."

As you whish, call it whatever you want; according to Michel experiencing the feelings of other people via their common higher self is not a disease. Look here:

unusual realities
hallucinations
delusions
disordered thinking
unusual emotional expression
social withdrawal

This is what those good doctors think about the spiritual side of the reality you experience within and through your self. Do you agree with it? I don't. In fact as they havn't detected the external effect of foreign feelings on the subjects suspected with schizophrenia they have left this side of the equation unexplored and are continuing to ignore it. Well I can't consider their health advice to be of any value as all they came up with is 'unusual' 'hallucinations' 'disorders' etc. note these words... It's obvious that they don't have a clue as to what they are talking about. Can you call this a scientific approach? changing medical terms hasn't helped anyone understanding anything either.

I'm asking you now: Can an inappropriate way of adressing the matter, lead to compelxions and diseases or not?

We have already spoken about his statement that the Thiaooubians support America, but if we look at the whole quote, it seems again that Michel did intend to use 'support' and not 'supported'.

From the japanese interviews of Michel I came to know his exact view upon America and their plans of total world domination, anyway reagrdless of what Michel thinks the message fro the people of thiaoouba is clear: no counrty has the right to dominate over other people of our planet thorugh any totalitarian and militrary means. I believe Michel has naturally had his share of doubts and learning toward all the periods of the history of our planet. The fact is that these discussions are all local, the mainstream guidelines are given, and Dictatorship, Racism, Sexism, Fanticism, Militarism, Totalitarism, etc. are all condemned.

[Robanan]

Everywhere I look, even in organized religion, people contradict one another in what they believe. I, on the other hand, do not understand how anyone can believe anything if they know their neighbour does in something else. Everyone believes with all their heart and mind. Now take note that I'm talking about "deeper" or more wholistic beliefs, a concept which I have difficulty putting into form here, but I'm sure you know what I mean (if you can make sense of that jabber).

As the "intellect" is an evolutionary process it would be normal for some people to have a more complete understanding than others. My point: some beliefs would be more correct than others, and some wrong altogether, and if the Thiaoouba prophecy is a creation of the imagination it is damaging to that spiritual, or intellectual, evolution. I guess not if it has an indirect sort of affect, but I still think perpetuating false information (particularly at that level) is harmful and shouldn't be done intentionally.

Maybe the after-life is whatever you imagine it to be? That makes more sense than everyone thinking it's something slightly else. It cannot be everything at once unless it is of one's own creation. Atleast that's a presumption restricted to my intellect. Wouldn't that be lame?

So I suppose I have to make my own discovery. But how can you trust your own reality? How can you trust what you have learned today? That is the problem to begin with, is it not? VERY frustrating!

Well, this seems to be exactly the whole point and as I hope you noticed the intellect can evolve and develop itself from within itself. As one comes to realize this point and understand the necessary requirments needed for intellectual development, then almost 80% of the whole objective picture of the reality of the universe around us, becomes clear.

There seems to be much more to it, much more than being able to analyse and align yourself among the many different belief systems available, even from a stand-out point of view which may require more capabilities of objective thinking than the capabilities required to study religions and belief systems from within their system. I'm talking about knowledge, knowing and understanding and their relative effect upon ones intellectual/spiritual development, regardless of what people decide to believe in.

When you consider todays situation with all the contemporary belief systems, as an immutable natural fact then it turns out that there seems to be almost no sense to talk about things that are subject of popular scruntiny based upon all the individual tendencies going toward different belief systems. One thing I can say for sure, the river always flows down to the sea no matter how many people want to believe otherwise. The same must be with the afterlife, regardless of the way it's described in TP and the presumptions restricted to anyones intellect it should be a subject for study and discovery specially when you saw and have seen and had listened and have heard that consciousness is indeed immaterial and is not affected by ones physical death and that the intellect as an integral part of your self and therfore your consciousness is bound to be able to develop as it whishes and decrees necessary for its self. The whole subject of the afterlife is not another reason to frame and establish a belief system there is no point to since all belief systems are based on ignoring all that the individual fails or misses to understand. On the road which you have decided to undertake, little by little you will start noticing and appreciating the patterns of intelligent design in the universe around you and in the reality you percieve within and through your own self.

Your own understanding is the only thing you can trust, and this is exactly one of the reasons why you are better off learning to increase it, therefore developing your intellect as your own needs to satisfy your spiritual longings grow, becomes outmost necessary.

Reality is only real when you experience it yourself.

[pax47]

Alisima is right. The message of the book (TP) is Love. It is not important whether it's true or not.

[ronald]

someone loves you but,
it is not import whether it's true or not