But I do think about this topic myself. I dont think cloning is any more than a different physical way to conceive a living soul into the physical dimension. In this sense I don't see how such an offspring would not have its own individual soul. However it is a cleverly synthetic method to do so, which seems to lead to health problems in the cloned offspring; I found this particular article which touches on it, at http://www.shopnatural.coop/news.htm - from 2005.
This gets at the question of when the astral body enters the physical, and what conditions must be present to have this happen. We dont know. But I believe Michel mentioned that the physical stuff is separate. I dont intend to put words in his mouth, and I'd rather reproduction simply continue as a sexual nature rather than cloning as it can be misused, perhaps not easily, but given the way things are going, misused. However, 'we' don't know much about astral body except its connected in 'some way' via a weak electrical current in our brain [there is an article on the internet called 'consciousness as circulating wavetrain' an interesting read]. And we don't know how to measure astral electrons, I would presume they are exactly like our 'physical' electrons, so I wonder why we can't yet visualize them under electron microscopes. Maybe its how they're oriented, maybe its because astral electrons exist across different dimensions as well, making location even more of a challenge than for 'non-astral' electrons??? This can certainly become another topic [probably is already].
A Wikipedia entry on 'adult stem cells': http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adult_stem_cells
The article regarding the recent discovery of stem cells via skin cells [nonembryonic, noninvasive Im assuming]
Scientists are looking externally to 'cheat' and make cells do what they want. But I would think that this removes the context in which the body's cells are intended to operate. Not excluding natural means of cellular repair such as detoxificaiton through natural things like herbs or acupuncture etc, perhaps scientists involved with this technology are missing something important, that could help to make such a truly noninvasive and all-applicable pluripotent cellular therapy from happening that might be needed for other cases [untreatable infertility, unnecessary surgeries, advanced cancers, direct trauma]. To remove a skin cell, or any other cell, not just an embryo, from its environment, I would think, will 'confuse' the cell, possibly upsetting it or killing it [starving it]. Maybe though, sometimes, it will function fine in its new environment, and this is 'success.' I'm no expert to say whether it is or isn't successful if it appears successful. But I've got a few reasons to suppose it isn't. The above process for example required viruses to be introduced in order to create the desired effects. And cancer was an unknown factor in concerns of its re-differentiation. Today our scientist still don't quite understand the role of viruses in cellular activities, where they belong, or why they are going where they shouldn't go. Of course, viruses aren't actually alive, but they are byproducts of metabolic processes that do influence what happens elsewhere when they travel elsewhere. Like mobile lysosomes or peroxisomes, maybe [in terms of destructiveness i suppose]
By contrast, the work of Dr. Robert O. Becker, look here for more information, at
http://www.theseekerbooks.com/articles/electric.htm - on a specific type of microcurrent via pulsed-silver iontophoresis, has shown to noninvasively [or, less invasively] introduce two agents [silver, and electricity] which are both known to be therapeutic in their own right, but, specifically, and for some reason, together, can initiate amazing changes to produce stem cells, that can aid in things such as regrowing bones, or tissues even. He was researching the next step, presumably plastic or organ replacement type research in the 1980s, when his necessary federal funding was cut and all his efforts were put to a stop. It seems we will never know the true potential of this, and while I believe it is better [compared to embryonic stem cells, adult stem cells, or virus-mediated skin cell versions of stem cells] it is bulky, costly and awkward, compared to regenerating cells *at will.* [speaking of which, anyone have more info here?] In TP of course, artificial insemination was implied, however, not explicitly. Unless I misremember. Ah, a new word. Misremember. Perhaps some sort of subtle electrical imprinting. Anyway, I can't and won't say beyond that, but nonetheless it is also something that catches my attention once again. Actually, thanks for bringing it up, bhuvan. Hmmm. To my knowledge Dr. Becker didn't suggest transportation of cells from one environment to another, but I haven't read his work seriously in quite a while, so if I'm wrong please correct me on that.
This implies that the 'soul' of the cells, even though they have left their original body, are actually linked with the cells themselves.TP wrote:‘Have you ever wondered why, that of the billions of individuals on a planet like
yours, there are no two fingerprints the same: and why, what we call the
‘crystalline’ of the blood, is just as unique among individuals as the fingerprint?
‘Your experts and technicians on Earth, and on other planets, have tried and
still try to create a human body. Have they succeeded? In regards to the robots
they have made, not even the most highly perfected will ever be more than a
vulgar machine in comparison with the human mechanism.
‘To go back to the crystalline I mentioned just now, it is best described as a
certain vibration particular to the blood of each individual. It has nothing to do
with the blood group. Various religious sects on Earth believe absolutely in the
‘rightness’ of refusing blood transfusions. Their reasons relate to the teachings
and books of their religious teachings and their own interpretations of these,
whereas they should look to the real reason, which is the impact the different
vibrations have on each other.
‘If it is a large transfusion, it can have an influence on the recipient to a degree
and, for a length of time, which varies according to the volume of the
transfusion. This influence, of course, is never dangerous.
‘After a time, which never exceeds one month, the vibrations of the recipient’s
Cloning requires a cell from the original organism. Therefor, no part of the 'soul' is lost when the animal/plant/bacteria/whatever is cloned. Like at conception, where a single cell multiplies and so would the 'soul,' so does the 'soul' of the cloned cell when it multiplies into the whole organism.
Another person claiming successful human cloning is 'Rael', who is very pro human cloning, [and a cult leader of sorts] and is involved with a gene company called clonaid. They say a cloned baby is born already, and this was back in 2002. But later he claims it might be a hoax! Obviously though, he is dedicated to human cloning...
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/12/ ... index.html
http://www.rickross.com/reference/raeli ... ans45.html
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/artic ... E_ID=30605
Now, Heres an intersting article from a tcm/energetic perspective, positively linking cloning to jing [essence] deficiency:
I know, in my previous post I thought cloned offspring have souls, now I guess I think otherwise... Theres some other related/relevant TCM ideas here that to me also are very interesting, regarding essence, qi and spirit, but I want to find some primary quotes before posting further on them now. I don't want to misrepresent them, as they can sometimes get complicated.
I think you missed the point of the quote and my post... Cloned offspring from a parent somatic cell DO have 'souls'/higher bodies.Rezo wrote: I know, in my previous post I thought cloned offspring have souls, now I guess I think otherwise, actually I think Im just quick to agree sometimes